Grüß Dich!
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Mark
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Mark
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Max Sinister
Well, I think the 68ers were justified; at the very least, it should be understandable that they were angry about the fact that an Ex-Nazi (Kiesinger) was able to become chancellor, that the Social Democrats even helped him, about the killing of Benno Ohnesorg by a policeman, the shah of Persia and the Bildzeitung that constantly agitated and influenced a neo-nazi to shoot on Rudi Dutschke.
The Radikalenerlass: Helmut Schmidt and Herbert Wehner were heavily against, but Willy Brandt insisted on it; sad, but true.
Many people were checked, relatively few were actually fired / not hired; some cases were just ridicilous (train drivers, nurses, cleaning woman (what's Putzfrau in English?)).
The Radikalenerlass: Helmut Schmidt and Herbert Wehner were heavily against, but Willy Brandt insisted on it; sad, but true.
Many people were checked, relatively few were actually fired / not hired; some cases were just ridicilous (train drivers, nurses, cleaning woman (what's Putzfrau in English?)).
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Mark
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Ponder
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Mark schrieb am 2003-05-09 20:25 :
Do you think denazification was successful?
[/quote]
Denazification:
It was only partly a success. There are several things to criticise regarding the realisation of this campain. A part of it were the questionaires which classified the citizens into 4 (i guess it was 4) groups. Unfortunatly because of the overwhemlming bureaucracy of this task, and often the impossibility to verify the declarations it can not be said that it was a real success. Moreover the so called "Persilscheine" (issued by clergymen & co) exonerated many high ranking nazis, whereas normal followers sometimes were punished in more grave ways. This effect was added with the juristdiction being laid into the hands of "ordinary people" (Spruchkammer)<!-- BBCode Note-Marker Start-One --><font color="#FF0000">*<!-- BBCode Note-Marker Start-Two -->1<!-- BBCode Note-Marker End-One --><!-- BBCode Note-Marker End-Two --> as denuniciation was widely spread.
These facts lead sometimes to distrust to the new system and juristdiction.
Nevertheless it must be said that many delinquents were caught and rightful punished.
The answer to the other question follows tomorrow
<!-- BBCode Note Start --><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Fußnoten:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE><!-- BBCode Note Start-One --><font color="#FF0000"><!-- BBCode Note End-One -->1<!-- BBCode Note Start-Two --><br><!-- BBCode Note End-Two -->they were allowed to impose different penalties<!-- BBCode Note Start-Three --><br><br><!-- BBCode Note End-Three --></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><!-- BBCode Note End -->
Mark schrieb am 2003-05-09 20:25 :
Do you think denazification was successful?
[/quote]
Denazification:
It was only partly a success. There are several things to criticise regarding the realisation of this campain. A part of it were the questionaires which classified the citizens into 4 (i guess it was 4) groups. Unfortunatly because of the overwhemlming bureaucracy of this task, and often the impossibility to verify the declarations it can not be said that it was a real success. Moreover the so called "Persilscheine" (issued by clergymen & co) exonerated many high ranking nazis, whereas normal followers sometimes were punished in more grave ways. This effect was added with the juristdiction being laid into the hands of "ordinary people" (Spruchkammer)<!-- BBCode Note-Marker Start-One --><font color="#FF0000">*<!-- BBCode Note-Marker Start-Two -->1<!-- BBCode Note-Marker End-One --><!-- BBCode Note-Marker End-Two --> as denuniciation was widely spread.
These facts lead sometimes to distrust to the new system and juristdiction.
Nevertheless it must be said that many delinquents were caught and rightful punished.
The answer to the other question follows tomorrow
<!-- BBCode Note Start --><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Fußnoten:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE><!-- BBCode Note Start-One --><font color="#FF0000"><!-- BBCode Note End-One -->1<!-- BBCode Note Start-Two --><br><!-- BBCode Note End-Two -->they were allowed to impose different penalties<!-- BBCode Note Start-Three --><br><br><!-- BBCode Note End-Three --></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><!-- BBCode Note End -->
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Ponder
Zwar nicht gestern, aber trotzdem mal weitergeschrieben - zu Abwechslung mal in deutsch
Adenauers harter Ostkurs:
Ich vermute mal als Beispiel wurde die ungeprüfte Stalinnote genannt?
Auf jeden Fall - ich könnte länger ausholen, aber wenns kurz auch geht: Adenauer hatte nicht wirklich eine Entscheidungsmöglichkeit. Die 4 Siegermächte, bzw. später dann die 2 Machtblöcke bestimmten im Wesentlichen die Politik Deutschlands (im Sinne der außerpolitischen Beziehungen, aber auch der innerdeutschen). Ein sehr viel weicherer Kurs wäre also gar nicht möglich gewesen...
Adenauers harter Ostkurs:
Ich vermute mal als Beispiel wurde die ungeprüfte Stalinnote genannt?
Auf jeden Fall - ich könnte länger ausholen, aber wenns kurz auch geht: Adenauer hatte nicht wirklich eine Entscheidungsmöglichkeit. Die 4 Siegermächte, bzw. später dann die 2 Machtblöcke bestimmten im Wesentlichen die Politik Deutschlands (im Sinne der außerpolitischen Beziehungen, aber auch der innerdeutschen). Ein sehr viel weicherer Kurs wäre also gar nicht möglich gewesen...
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Mark
Just had my exam, I think I did ok in it 
@ Max Sinister: I agree those things mean the protest was justified, but do you think the state was justified in its reaction considering the rise of the Baader Meinhof gang (mostly imprisoned in 1972) and a new communist party? Martin Schleyer was killed in 1977 by the Red Army Faction, and a West German plane was hijacked in Somalia.
@ Max Sinister: I agree those things mean the protest was justified, but do you think the state was justified in its reaction considering the rise of the Baader Meinhof gang (mostly imprisoned in 1972) and a new communist party? Martin Schleyer was killed in 1977 by the Red Army Faction, and a West German plane was hijacked in Somalia.
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Max Sinister
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Mark wrote:
Do you think denazification was successful?
[/quote]
Not enough.
You can see it by the fact that there are still nazis running around free and unpunished who committed crimes of the worst kind. And by the fact that there's no high political office where no nazi has been in - Kiesinger as chancellor, Carstens as federal president, Filbinger as minister president...
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Was Ostpolitik a good idea, or should Adenauer's 'position of strength' policy have been maintained? (put aside fact that Germany's reunified) :-p
[/quote]
Well, as it has already been quoted: During the time when the Cold War was hottest, the Merkins maybe hadn't liked it, but later this politic was sometimes ridiculous. The FRG had to break off every contact to states that accepted East Germany as the legitimate Germany (Hallsteindoktrin), and their we-don't-negotiate-with-them politic was absolutely successless. Willy Brandt's Ostpolitik at least made it possible for the separated families to meet again.
Mark wrote:
Do you think denazification was successful?
[/quote]
Not enough.
You can see it by the fact that there are still nazis running around free and unpunished who committed crimes of the worst kind. And by the fact that there's no high political office where no nazi has been in - Kiesinger as chancellor, Carstens as federal president, Filbinger as minister president...<!-- BBCode Quote Start --><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Zitat:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
Was Ostpolitik a good idea, or should Adenauer's 'position of strength' policy have been maintained? (put aside fact that Germany's reunified) :-p
[/quote]
Well, as it has already been quoted: During the time when the Cold War was hottest, the Merkins maybe hadn't liked it, but later this politic was sometimes ridiculous. The FRG had to break off every contact to states that accepted East Germany as the legitimate Germany (Hallsteindoktrin), and their we-don't-negotiate-with-them politic was absolutely successless. Willy Brandt's Ostpolitik at least made it possible for the separated families to meet again.
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Mark
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Max Sinister
@Mark:
Was the state justified in its reaction? Tough question.
OK, here are some facts:
- Although the RAF had just some dozen "die-hards" and a few hundred helpers, they now controlled (as it seemed) everyone and everywhere. Especially people who somehow seemed to be lefties. They didn't have very much success in finding terrorists, though. (It's said, however, that the RAF was supported by the Stasi. Maybe that's the reason why they managed to stay free for such a long time.)
Was the state justified in its reaction? Tough question.
OK, here are some facts:
- Although the RAF had just some dozen "die-hards" and a few hundred helpers, they now controlled (as it seemed) everyone and everywhere. Especially people who somehow seemed to be lefties. They didn't have very much success in finding terrorists, though. (It's said, however, that the RAF was supported by the Stasi. Maybe that's the reason why they managed to stay free for such a long time.)
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cheery_littlebottom
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Mark
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catskind
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Max Sinister
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Tod
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catskind
Aaaaaaalso:
Sie heißt Jennifer Leonie Maria,
ist geboren am 8.6.,um 20:20 Uhr, bei einem deftigen Gewitter.
Sie wog bei der Geburt 2050 gr und war 45cm groß.
Sie ist so klein gewesen, weil sie schon in der 35. Woche auf die Welt kam.
Die Kleine wurde in der Gebärmutter nicht richtig mit Nähstoffen versorgt.
Die Ärtze im Krankenhaus konnten das eine Weile kompensieren, doch ab einer bestimmten Größe klappt das nicht mehr und die Geburt wurde eingeleitet.
Darum war ich auch fünf Wochen in der Klinik.
Tja, aber nun ist klein Jenny da und es geht ihr sehr gut!
Vielen Dank für alle eure Glückwünsche!
Sie heißt Jennifer Leonie Maria,
ist geboren am 8.6.,um 20:20 Uhr, bei einem deftigen Gewitter.
Sie wog bei der Geburt 2050 gr und war 45cm groß.
Sie ist so klein gewesen, weil sie schon in der 35. Woche auf die Welt kam.
Die Kleine wurde in der Gebärmutter nicht richtig mit Nähstoffen versorgt.
Die Ärtze im Krankenhaus konnten das eine Weile kompensieren, doch ab einer bestimmten Größe klappt das nicht mehr und die Geburt wurde eingeleitet.
Darum war ich auch fünf Wochen in der Klinik.
Tja, aber nun ist klein Jenny da und es geht ihr sehr gut!
Vielen Dank für alle eure Glückwünsche!
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frenchAngua